Conversing Across the Divide: A Meeting Among Different Perspectives
Introducing the Participants
First Diner: P., 34, London
Occupation Ex- civil servant, currently a student focusing on public health
Political history Voted the Green Party last time (also a member of the political group); formerly Labour Party. Identifies as “left, and internationalist rather than nationalist”
Interesting fact A drawing of a tea cup he did as a kid was once hung in the Irish National Gallery
Second Diner: Akshat, 43, from Harrow
Profession Risk analyst in the infrastructure industry
Voting record Originally from the Indian subcontinent, he has resided in the UK for five years, and supported Conservative. Identifies as “slightly right of centre”
Amuse bouche He taught himself to understand the Urdu language. “I have no use for it, I was just fascinated”
Initial impressions
Akshat Over the last 20 years, I’ve lived and worked in the Middle East, South Korea, the United States. The topics we discussed are focused on Britain, but they are also universal, because people's lives largely evolve similarly across the world. I was expecting a staunch liberal, but he was quite measured – we engaged in a productive, logical conversation. I drank beer, Peter had mojitos.
Peter We split appetizers – seafood rolls, steamed buns, radish cakes with sprouts, which were excellent. I was a little nervous, as I think he was too. Was he going to attack me for being a snowflake? We’re both immigrants. I grew up in Dublin; I’ve lived in the US and Spain. We bonded over our love of London.
The big beef
The first participant I look at immigration like adding salt to a meal. When you add a little bit, the food tastes wonderful. Add too little or too much and the meal is either too bland or too salty.
Peter Akshat had a metaphor regarding salt. It would be a funny place to be if the state was choosing some ideal ethnic makeup of the country.
The first participant There are, sadly, people escaping oppression, but a lot of migrants coming to the United Kingdom are economic migrants who may not contribute much and can weigh on the benefit system. No one compels you to move to a new country for opportunity, so you ought to relocate if you are able to support yourself and your family.
Peter We got lost with certain details. In my view it is the case that you arrive and work and then following a half-decade you get indefinite leave to remain. No process is guaranteed. The climate has been unwelcoming since Theresa May, visa fees are quite expensive, you pay an healthcare levy, access to benefits is limited. There is no special treatment for anybody. And concerning the new policies, whereby you can’t bring your family over, it’s incredible to say: we desire your labor, but we don’t want you. I believe we have to have a degree of humanity.
Common ground
The first participant Peter questions unchecked capitalism. I am, too, but at the same time, economic growth benefits society and ought to be promoted.
The second participant We each have global outlooks. And we agreed that some parts of society – politics, the press – benefit from creating conflict. We did find common ground in fundamentals and ethics.
For afters
Akshat Peter is of the opinion that because the United Kingdom profited from colonial times, it should pay reparations to affected nations. I simply think: you cannot judge history with present day morality; times are different, modern people were not responsible of events decades or a century ago. Let’s say the Britain had to compensate India, it would be a huge amount of money. Is Britain able to do that? No.
The second participant In the past, I believe adequate reflection occurred with the colonial past. For example, upon my arrival to the United Kingdom, the public weren’t aware of the Irish famine and the part that colonialism played in it. My view is decolonization is not merely about signing a cheque, it should be about examining past errors and where we should be now.
Takeaways
Akshat It may not alter the my perspective, but I appreciate Peter’s concerns. I converse with individuals regularly whose views are opposite to mine. The goal is uniting people to the same page, so that everyone can work towards the improvement of society.
Peter We remained for 150 minutes. He enjoyed a sweet treat and I had some sweet Japanese wine. I did not convince him of any point, but we each liked dinner, so we might become more open to having conversations with others in the coming times.
